In the pass week, I’ve looked at a number of different documents trying to find an answer to the question - Who was Mrs. Nimrod Thacker?
I started with the work of other researchers, and tested their conclusions with the available evidence.
Below are my own conclusions.
Month of Birth:
January
Supporting documentation
1900 census for Frances Thacker
Death Record of Frances Thacker
February (I reject)
(No supporting documentation)
Year of Birth
1822 or 1823 (Too Close to Call)
1822
(Supporting documentation)
1. Death Record of Frances Thacker
2. 1870 and 1900 census for Frances Thacker
1823
(Supporting documentation)
1. 1850, 1860 and 1880 census for Frances Thacker
1821 (which I reject)
(Supporting documentation)
1. Frances J. Thacker’s widow pension affidavit given in December 1893 which listed her age as 72.
State of Birth
Virginia
(Supporting documentation)
1. 1850 and 1860 census for Frances Thacker
(However, this doesn’t preclude West Virginia)
2. 1870, 1880, and 1900 census for Frances Thacker
3. 1880 census for Clarinda Marcum, David Thacker, Nicholas Thacker, Mary Francis Thacker, Catherine Thacker, Hiram Thacker, Louisa Garrett. (Census Question – Birthplace of Mother)
4. 1900 census for Martha Thacker, David Thacker, Sara Jane Thacker, Nicholas Thacker, Catherine Thacker and Hiram Thacker (Census Question – Birthplace of Mother.)
5. 1910 census for Clarinda Marcum, Sara Jane Thacker, Catherine Thacker and Hiram Thacker. (Census Question – Birthplace of Mother.)
6. 1920 census for David Thacker, Nicholas Thacker, Catherine Thacker and Hiram Thacker. (Census Question – Birthplace of Mother)
7. 1930 census for Nicholas Thacker and Catherine Thacker. (Census Question – Birthplace of Mother.)
8. Death Record of Frances J. Thacker
9. Death Record of David Thacker.
West Virginia hypothesis (which I reject)
(Supporting documentation)
1. 1910 Census record for David Thacker and Nicholas Thacker (who listed father, Nimrod Thacker’s place of birth as West Virginia also. We know that Nimrod himself listed his place of birth as Louisa County, Virginia.
2. Death record of Sarah Jane Thacker which listed mother’s place of birth as “Old Virginia.”
Spelling of Frances/Francis
Because Frances could neither read nor write, either spelling could be considered correct. However, most people use the “es” to indicate female and “is” to indicate male, so I am using the “es” spelling.
Full Maiden Name
First Name
Frances
(Supporting documentation)
1. Census records 1850, 1860, 1870, 1880 and 1900 for Frances Thacker.
2. Obituary of daughter Louisa Garrett.
3. Death Record for Frances J. Thacker
4. Death Record of children, Sarah Jane Thacker, David Thacker and Louisa Thacker. (Informants were, Hannah Thacker, Hiram Thacker and Charles Garrett)
5. Application for Administration for Frances J. Thacker for estate of Nimrod N. Thacker.
6. Widow’s pension file for Frances J. Thacker, widow of Nimrod N. Thacker
7. Marriage Record of Frances J. Thacker and Nimrod N. Thacker (This is the only primary source available for Frances’s maiden name.)
Mary (which I reject)
(Supporting documentation)
1. Death record of son, Nicholas Thacker (Informant was Frank Thacker)
Middle name or Initial
J
(Supporting documentation)
1. Census record of 1860 and 1900 for Frances Thacker
2. Death record of Frances J. Thacker
3. Application for Administration for Frances J. Thacker for estate of Nimrod N. Thacker.
4. Widow’s pension file for Frances J. Thacker, widow of Nimrod N. Thacker
5. Marriage Record of Frances J. Thacker and Nimrod N. Thacker
Frances (which I reject) – no supporting documentation
Mary (which I reject) – no supporting documentation
Maiden name
Thacker
(Supporting documentation)
1. Marriage record of Frances J. Thacker and Nimrod N. Thacker
2. Death record of son, David Thacker (informant son, Hiram N. Thacker), which gives mother’s name as Frances Thacker.
3. Death record of daughter, Louisa Ellen Garrett (informant grandson, Charles Garrett), which gives mother’s name as Frances Thacker.
4. Widow’s pension file for Frances J. Thacker, widow of Nimrod N. Thacker – affidavit of Ivory Thacker (also to lesser extent affidavits of Cassmir Hawk, Finley Hartley, and William Burk,) which claims Frances was not previously married.
5. Death Record of Grandson Frank Thacker (informant, great grandson, Lloyd Thacker) which gives Frank’s mother as Mary Groves (Grover?)
Grover (which I reject)
Supporting documentation
1. Death record of son, Nicholas Thacker (informant grandson, Frank Thacker,) which gives mother’s name as Mary Grover.
Of course, it is always possible that new documentation will become available that will not support these conclusions. Then, as we did this time, we would look at the evidence, analyze the source, analyze the information, and decide how this new information changes the previous conclusions.
In Genealogy, we have to be willing to look at the evidence before us with a clear and unbiased eye. No matter how much we may be tempted, we shouldn’t try pounding square pegs into round holes, making our evidence conform to a preconceived conclusion.
Not if we care about the truth. Not if we want to get the story right.
Showing posts with label Frances. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Frances. Show all posts
Monday, October 4, 2010
Saturday, October 2, 2010
Mrs. Nimrod Thacker Part V **** Genealogy By the Numbers - Miscellaneous Records
When Nimrod Thacker died in 1893 he owned land. Whether a man has a will or not, land means there is something of value to be divided from his estate. Hiram Thacker made application of letters of appointment on behalf of his mother. It reads “The undersigned, whose Post Office address is Hawks, Ohio asks that the widow, Francis J. Thacker be appointed Administrator of the estate of said decedent.”
Notice once again that Frances is referred to as Francis J. not Mary Frances, or Frances Mary on this legal document. If she is really Mary Frances (or Frances Mary) wouldn’t she have been referred to as Mary Frances Thacker?
The next logical question is how did the marriage certificate read? Below is the copy of the marriage record found in Jackson County, Ohio.
As you can see on June 6, 1840 Nimrod N. Thacker and Frances Thacker applied for a marriage license and on July 23, 1840 Ellery Bascom certifies that he has wed Nimrod N. Thacker and Frances J. Thacker.
None of this is new information. However, notice once again no “Mary” appears on the document but she is clearly listed as Frances J. Thacker.
Several of us have speculated that Frances may have been previously married and that is why her last name appears as Thacker not Grover. If you believe that her year of birth was either 1822 or 1823 as the census and death records would indicate, then she would have been either 17 or 18 at the time of her marriage to Nimrod. It is still possible that she could have been married previously, but the time frame is certainly diminished.
When Frances applied for a widow’s pension after the death of her husband it required her to prove that she was indeed the widow of Nimrod Thacker. This necessitated several affidavits from people who could claim to have known both Frances and Nimrod.
Though Frances made an affidavit of her own (December 9, 1893 and stated her age as 72) it did not touch on the issues that we are trying to resolve, with the exceptions of stating her age and that instead of signing her name to the deposition, she put an “X” confirming that Frances could not write. However, there were three other depositions that were made that same year that are of interest.
On October 13, 1893 Cassmir Hawk gave a deposition in the matter of Frances J. Thacker, widow of Nimrod Thacker. Among the statements he made:
That she has been confined to her bed for five years past, and unable to perform any labor. Has not been married since her husbans (sic)death… Neither she or husban (sic) previously married … have known Numrad (sic) and wife for thirty years.
Clearly if Cassmir knew the Thackers for thirty years, he was not around to witness their wedding and he is merely going on hearsay. Still it is interesting to note that at the time of Nimrod’s death, it was thought that neither of them had been previously married.
Finley Hartley who also made his deposition on October 13, 1893 made similar remarks stating that Frances had been confined to a bed for five years and was unable to do work. That neither she nor Nimrod had married previously, and that he had known the couple for about “thirty years or more.”
The most interesting of the depositions given by William Burk and Ivory Thacker from oral statements. The written deposition is written as if both men gave the same statement, which reads:
Some 60 years ago Frances J. Thacker’s father came to this county when she was a young woman and settled near where I reside. Also Nimrod N. Thacker and by being intimately acquainted with both know that they were not previously married to (sic) their marriage to each other.
This affidavit was taken November 11, 1893 and the oral statements were made in the presence of O.F. Hawk who was the notary public. What’s interesting about this is that it clearly states that Frances was not married before her marriage to Nimrod and that she and her family came to the Wilkesville area sometime in the mid 1830’s.
So, what does all this research mean? Tomorrow we look at the conclusions based on our research.
References:
1. Application of Letters of Appointment, Vinton County Probate Court, Estate of Nimrod N Thacker, from the Private Files of Judy Oiler, emailed to Teresa Snyder 28 Sept 2008.
2. Jackson County, Ohio, Marriage Register, Probate Court, Volume 1, Page 116, Nimrod N. Thacker and Frances J. Thacker, 1840, Jackson County Probate Office, accessed and photographed by Teresa Snyder, 20 May 2008.
3. Frances J. Thacker, widow’s pension no. 582204, certificate no. 404166, service of Nimrod N. Thacker (Pvt., Co. D, 194th Ohio Inf., Civil War), Case Files of Approved Pension Applications, 1863-1934, Civil War and Later pension files, Dept of Veteran Affairs National Archives, Washington, D.C.
Notice once again that Frances is referred to as Francis J. not Mary Frances, or Frances Mary on this legal document. If she is really Mary Frances (or Frances Mary) wouldn’t she have been referred to as Mary Frances Thacker?
The next logical question is how did the marriage certificate read? Below is the copy of the marriage record found in Jackson County, Ohio.
As you can see on June 6, 1840 Nimrod N. Thacker and Frances Thacker applied for a marriage license and on July 23, 1840 Ellery Bascom certifies that he has wed Nimrod N. Thacker and Frances J. Thacker.
None of this is new information. However, notice once again no “Mary” appears on the document but she is clearly listed as Frances J. Thacker.
Several of us have speculated that Frances may have been previously married and that is why her last name appears as Thacker not Grover. If you believe that her year of birth was either 1822 or 1823 as the census and death records would indicate, then she would have been either 17 or 18 at the time of her marriage to Nimrod. It is still possible that she could have been married previously, but the time frame is certainly diminished.
When Frances applied for a widow’s pension after the death of her husband it required her to prove that she was indeed the widow of Nimrod Thacker. This necessitated several affidavits from people who could claim to have known both Frances and Nimrod.
Though Frances made an affidavit of her own (December 9, 1893 and stated her age as 72) it did not touch on the issues that we are trying to resolve, with the exceptions of stating her age and that instead of signing her name to the deposition, she put an “X” confirming that Frances could not write. However, there were three other depositions that were made that same year that are of interest.
On October 13, 1893 Cassmir Hawk gave a deposition in the matter of Frances J. Thacker, widow of Nimrod Thacker. Among the statements he made:
That she has been confined to her bed for five years past, and unable to perform any labor. Has not been married since her husbans (sic)death… Neither she or husban (sic) previously married … have known Numrad (sic) and wife for thirty years.
Clearly if Cassmir knew the Thackers for thirty years, he was not around to witness their wedding and he is merely going on hearsay. Still it is interesting to note that at the time of Nimrod’s death, it was thought that neither of them had been previously married.
Finley Hartley who also made his deposition on October 13, 1893 made similar remarks stating that Frances had been confined to a bed for five years and was unable to do work. That neither she nor Nimrod had married previously, and that he had known the couple for about “thirty years or more.”
The most interesting of the depositions given by William Burk and Ivory Thacker from oral statements. The written deposition is written as if both men gave the same statement, which reads:
Some 60 years ago Frances J. Thacker’s father came to this county when she was a young woman and settled near where I reside. Also Nimrod N. Thacker and by being intimately acquainted with both know that they were not previously married to (sic) their marriage to each other.
This affidavit was taken November 11, 1893 and the oral statements were made in the presence of O.F. Hawk who was the notary public. What’s interesting about this is that it clearly states that Frances was not married before her marriage to Nimrod and that she and her family came to the Wilkesville area sometime in the mid 1830’s.
So, what does all this research mean? Tomorrow we look at the conclusions based on our research.
References:
1. Application of Letters of Appointment, Vinton County Probate Court, Estate of Nimrod N Thacker, from the Private Files of Judy Oiler, emailed to Teresa Snyder 28 Sept 2008.
2. Jackson County, Ohio, Marriage Register, Probate Court, Volume 1, Page 116, Nimrod N. Thacker and Frances J. Thacker, 1840, Jackson County Probate Office, accessed and photographed by Teresa Snyder, 20 May 2008.
3. Frances J. Thacker, widow’s pension no. 582204, certificate no. 404166, service of Nimrod N. Thacker (Pvt., Co. D, 194th Ohio Inf., Civil War), Case Files of Approved Pension Applications, 1863-1934, Civil War and Later pension files, Dept of Veteran Affairs National Archives, Washington, D.C.
Friday, October 1, 2010
Mrs. Nimrod Thacker Part IV *** Genealogy By the Numbers - Death Records
A couple of years ago I wrote a blog post on my Desktop Genealogist Unplugged Blog entitled, “Death Certificates – Sources of Primary & Secondary Information.” I’d refer you to it, but that sounds a little too much like homework. Instead, I’ll summarize what I’m sure you’ll agree was undoubtedly a brilliant post. (Okay, you can’t kill a girl for fantasizing.)
The gist of the post was that while a Death Certificate is a primary source of information for some of the details found on a typical death record, it is only a secondary source for other items. It is a secondary source when (and how often do I get chance to quote myself?) “the information given was many months, years or decades after the event. So a death certificate is a secondary source for the following:
1. Date of Birth
2. Age
3. Place of Birth
4. Father's name
5. Father's place of birth
6. Mother's name
7. Mother's place of birth
Secondary information is only as reliable as the person giving the information.
Let me repeat that last sentence. Secondary information is only as reliable as the person giving the information. This means it is important to look at who the informant is on a death certificate, because we are taking their word that the above seven pieces of information are accurate - more about that in a moment.
Prior to December 20, 1908 death records in Ohio were kept at the local level. The information was recorded in ledger like books which were located at the county probate office. Rarely did they include the name of the individual’s father or mother.
Since Frances died March 27, 1901 her death was recorded in one of these ledgers.
Frances Death Record Page 1
Frances Death Record Page 2 (See X)
State of Birth
Let’s ease on into the subject by first taking a look at where the informants thought that the mother of the deceased was born. Three said that the information was not known (or unknown) to them. The three that gave this information were Bertha McKenzie, the daughter of Hiram, Frank Thacker, the son of Nicholas, and Mrs. Elmer (Nina) Weese, daughter of Catherine. Charles Garrett, the son of Louisa, gave the birthplace of Frances as Ohio (which coincides with the information found in Louisa’s obituary.)
Hannah Thacker, Sara Jane’s daughter, said that Frances was born in “Old Virginia.” Why did she stipulate Old Virginia as opposed to Virginia? Hannah’s answer may have led to the speculation that Frances was born in the portion of Virginia that would later become West Virginia. This along with the responses the census taker listed for both Nicholas and David in the 1910 is probably the reason some researchers list West Virginia for Frances’s place of birth.
The one lone informant who listed Virginia as the place of birth was also the only informant who was a son to Frances, the rest of the informants being grandchildren. Hiram was the informant in the death of his brother David in 1924. Do we credit a child’s knowledge of their parent over a grandchild’s? Not necessarily, but the fact that Hiram’s information coincides with 4 of the 5 censuses where Frances was included and an additional 23 censuses when her children answered “Virginia,” to the question of where she was born, does give some credence to Hiram’s answers.
That becomes even more important when we look at the issue of name.
First Name
Below is the death certificate of Nicholas Thacker in which his son Frank acted as informant. He lists the mother of Nicholas as Mary Grover. Notice he does not mention or allude to in anyway that her name was Frances.
Last Name
Notice also, that not only is he the only individual to list her name as Mary, but also the only one to give the last name of Grover.
Hiram lists his mother’s name as Francis Thacker when he is the informant for the death record of his brother, David. Charles Garrett, the grandson of Frances, also lists his mother Louisa’s mother as Francis Thacker.
The questions is, of course, did Hiram and Charles mean that Frances’s maiden name is Thacker or are they admitting that they did not know the maiden name of Frances and so used her married name?
There is one last death certificate that we should take a look at, before we leave the subject, and that is the Death Certificate of Frank Thacker, the son of Nicholas. The informant was Frank’s son, Lloyd Thacker. Look closely at the name Lloyd gives as the mother of Frank – Mary Groves.
In 1871, Nicholas Thacker married Mary Murray. He and Mary had four children – Frank, Ambrose, George and Herman. It is unclear whether Mary died or if they divorced but in 1883 Nicholas married a second time to Mary Freeman. Is it possible that Mary Groves or Grover has more to do with Nicholas’s first wife and not his mother?
In part five, we will take a look at an application for administrative appointment, a marriage record and a pension file, to see what information they have to offer.
References:
1. “Death Certificates – Sources of Primary & Secondary Information,” Terry Snyder Weblog: Desktop Genealogist Unplugged, 31 Oct 2007. http://desktopgenealogistunplugged.blogspot.com/2008/03/death-certificates-sources-of-primary.html.w: 2010.
2. Sperry, Ken. Genealogical Research in Ohio, Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Company, 2003.
3. Vinton County, Ohio, Death Record Register, Probate Court, Vinton County Probate Office, Francis J. Thacker, accessed and photographed by Teresa Snyder, 21 May 2008.
4. Certificate of Death: Sarah Jane Thacker, Filed 26 June 1917. State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 5778, File no. 43333, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
5. Certificate of Death: David Thacker, Filed 4 June 1924. State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 1311, File no. 37162, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
6. Certificate of Death: Hiram N. Thacker, Filed 12 Oct 1939, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 392, File no. 59506, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 19 July 2008.)
7. Certificate of Death: Nicholas Thacker, Filed 6 Jan 1941, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 1311, File no. 7236, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
8. Certificate of Death: Catherine Thacker, Filed 28 Nov 1945, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 392, File no. 65706, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 24 Jan 2008.)
9. Certificate of Death: Louisa Ellen Garrett, Filed 11 Feb 1948, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 1160, File no. 12473, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
10. Certificate of Death: Franklin Thacker, Filed 8 Jan 1949, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 1311, File no. 80400, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
The gist of the post was that while a Death Certificate is a primary source of information for some of the details found on a typical death record, it is only a secondary source for other items. It is a secondary source when (and how often do I get chance to quote myself?) “the information given was many months, years or decades after the event. So a death certificate is a secondary source for the following:
1. Date of Birth
2. Age
3. Place of Birth
4. Father's name
5. Father's place of birth
6. Mother's name
7. Mother's place of birth
Secondary information is only as reliable as the person giving the information.
Let me repeat that last sentence. Secondary information is only as reliable as the person giving the information. This means it is important to look at who the informant is on a death certificate, because we are taking their word that the above seven pieces of information are accurate - more about that in a moment.
Prior to December 20, 1908 death records in Ohio were kept at the local level. The information was recorded in ledger like books which were located at the county probate office. Rarely did they include the name of the individual’s father or mother.
Since Frances died March 27, 1901 her death was recorded in one of these ledgers.
Frances Death Record Page 1
Frances Death Record Page 2 (See X)In summary, this is what the ledger entry tells us: Francis J. Thacker, a white widow, died of consumption on March 27, 1901 at the age of 79 years, 2 months and 12 days. She was born in Virginia and died in Hawks, Ohio, where she was a resident. Her occupation was listed as housekeeper. The death was reported by C. Hartley. The age listed would indicate a birthday of January 15, 1822.
On December 20, 1908 a law went into effect that required both births and deaths to be recorded at the state level. This was the birth of the present day death certificate.
The lovely folks at FamilySearch.org have put the images of Ohio Death Certificates dated December 20, 1908 through 1953 online. Not only have they made the images available for viewing but they have also created a searchable database that speeds the process up considerably and also allows for some creative searching. (FamilySearch - and their legion of volunteer indexers - take a well deserved bow.)
Thanks to their efforts, I was able to locate the death records for six of the twelve known children of Nimrod and Frances. Those six are Nicholas, David, Sarah Jane, Catherine, Hiram and Louisa. Algerine, Mary Frances, Ambrose and Hannah Nancy are all known to have died prior to 1900. There is nothing known of the deaths of the remaining two children, Martha and my own ggg grandmother Clarinda.
Below I’ve created a jpeg file of a spreadsheet which I’ve found to be handy way of comparing information on the death certificates.
On December 20, 1908 a law went into effect that required both births and deaths to be recorded at the state level. This was the birth of the present day death certificate.
The lovely folks at FamilySearch.org have put the images of Ohio Death Certificates dated December 20, 1908 through 1953 online. Not only have they made the images available for viewing but they have also created a searchable database that speeds the process up considerably and also allows for some creative searching. (FamilySearch - and their legion of volunteer indexers - take a well deserved bow.)
Thanks to their efforts, I was able to locate the death records for six of the twelve known children of Nimrod and Frances. Those six are Nicholas, David, Sarah Jane, Catherine, Hiram and Louisa. Algerine, Mary Frances, Ambrose and Hannah Nancy are all known to have died prior to 1900. There is nothing known of the deaths of the remaining two children, Martha and my own ggg grandmother Clarinda.
Below I’ve created a jpeg file of a spreadsheet which I’ve found to be handy way of comparing information on the death certificates.
State of Birth
Let’s ease on into the subject by first taking a look at where the informants thought that the mother of the deceased was born. Three said that the information was not known (or unknown) to them. The three that gave this information were Bertha McKenzie, the daughter of Hiram, Frank Thacker, the son of Nicholas, and Mrs. Elmer (Nina) Weese, daughter of Catherine. Charles Garrett, the son of Louisa, gave the birthplace of Frances as Ohio (which coincides with the information found in Louisa’s obituary.)
Hannah Thacker, Sara Jane’s daughter, said that Frances was born in “Old Virginia.” Why did she stipulate Old Virginia as opposed to Virginia? Hannah’s answer may have led to the speculation that Frances was born in the portion of Virginia that would later become West Virginia. This along with the responses the census taker listed for both Nicholas and David in the 1910 is probably the reason some researchers list West Virginia for Frances’s place of birth.
The one lone informant who listed Virginia as the place of birth was also the only informant who was a son to Frances, the rest of the informants being grandchildren. Hiram was the informant in the death of his brother David in 1924. Do we credit a child’s knowledge of their parent over a grandchild’s? Not necessarily, but the fact that Hiram’s information coincides with 4 of the 5 censuses where Frances was included and an additional 23 censuses when her children answered “Virginia,” to the question of where she was born, does give some credence to Hiram’s answers.
That becomes even more important when we look at the issue of name.
First Name
Below is the death certificate of Nicholas Thacker in which his son Frank acted as informant. He lists the mother of Nicholas as Mary Grover. Notice he does not mention or allude to in anyway that her name was Frances.
Last Name
Notice also, that not only is he the only individual to list her name as Mary, but also the only one to give the last name of Grover.
Hiram lists his mother’s name as Francis Thacker when he is the informant for the death record of his brother, David. Charles Garrett, the grandson of Frances, also lists his mother Louisa’s mother as Francis Thacker.
The questions is, of course, did Hiram and Charles mean that Frances’s maiden name is Thacker or are they admitting that they did not know the maiden name of Frances and so used her married name?
There is one last death certificate that we should take a look at, before we leave the subject, and that is the Death Certificate of Frank Thacker, the son of Nicholas. The informant was Frank’s son, Lloyd Thacker. Look closely at the name Lloyd gives as the mother of Frank – Mary Groves.
In 1871, Nicholas Thacker married Mary Murray. He and Mary had four children – Frank, Ambrose, George and Herman. It is unclear whether Mary died or if they divorced but in 1883 Nicholas married a second time to Mary Freeman. Is it possible that Mary Groves or Grover has more to do with Nicholas’s first wife and not his mother?
In part five, we will take a look at an application for administrative appointment, a marriage record and a pension file, to see what information they have to offer.
References:
1. “Death Certificates – Sources of Primary & Secondary Information,” Terry Snyder Weblog: Desktop Genealogist Unplugged, 31 Oct 2007. http://desktopgenealogistunplugged.blogspot.com/2008/03/death-certificates-sources-of-primary.html.w: 2010.
2. Sperry, Ken. Genealogical Research in Ohio, Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Company, 2003.
3. Vinton County, Ohio, Death Record Register, Probate Court, Vinton County Probate Office, Francis J. Thacker, accessed and photographed by Teresa Snyder, 21 May 2008.
4. Certificate of Death: Sarah Jane Thacker, Filed 26 June 1917. State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 5778, File no. 43333, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
5. Certificate of Death: David Thacker, Filed 4 June 1924. State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 1311, File no. 37162, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
6. Certificate of Death: Hiram N. Thacker, Filed 12 Oct 1939, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 392, File no. 59506, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 19 July 2008.)
7. Certificate of Death: Nicholas Thacker, Filed 6 Jan 1941, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 1311, File no. 7236, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
8. Certificate of Death: Catherine Thacker, Filed 28 Nov 1945, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 392, File no. 65706, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 24 Jan 2008.)
9. Certificate of Death: Louisa Ellen Garrett, Filed 11 Feb 1948, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 1160, File no. 12473, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
10. Certificate of Death: Franklin Thacker, Filed 8 Jan 1949, State of Ohio, Dept of Health, Bureau of Vital Statistics, Reg. Dist. 1311, File no. 80400, digital images from FamilySearch Internet (www.familysearch.org: 23 Jan 2008.)
Thursday, September 30, 2010
Mrs. Nimrod Thacker Part III *** Genealogy By The Numbers - Obituaries
Okay, besides the obvious advantages of being able to look at online images on websites like the Library of Virginia, Ancestry.com and FamilySearch.org, the Internet has made communication between family researchers a snap. Thirty years ago no one could have imagined how quickly information could be exchanged between two family researchers. Type up a short note, attach a file and “boom” you’ve shared a little family history. Ah bliss, thy name is Internet.
With the advent of search engines like Google, suddenly you can find snippets of information that your 4th cousin once removed has posted online. I bet some of you found this post by that very same process. (Welcome, oh 3rd cousin twice removed!)
In fact, by this very same method, I found obituaries for three of Frances Thacker’s children – Nicholas Thacker, Sara Jane Thacker and Catherine Thacker Thacker. I also have a copy of Louisa Thacker Garrett’s obituary. (I will post a transcribed copy below.)
You can find a transcription of Nicholas Thacker’s obituary by checking out Lynn Byler’s, “ANCESTORS OF JOSEPH OGIER JOHNSON AND CAROLINE RACHAEL KRONK,” on Ancestry.com.
She gives the date of the obituary as January 8, 1941 but unfortunately no newspaper is listed. There is no mention of his parents, only the fact that he has three children living, “Frank Thacker, of Wilkesville and Herman, address unknown and one daughter Willidy Williams, Los Vegas, Nevada.” Nicholas himself was living at the home of Hiram Marks near Wilkesville.
Lynn also has the obituary for Sara Jane Thacker, which appeared according to Lynn in the Republican Tribune, July 4, 1917. It gives her parents as Mr. and Mrs. Nicholas Thacker. Interesting to those of researching her siblings but not germane to our current research quest, is the sentence that reads: She also leaves 2 sisters and 3 brothers to mourn their loss, Mrs. Henry Thacker, Chillicothe; Mrs. Charles Garrett of Wheelersburg; David Thacker of Hawk, Nicholas Thacker of Minerton; Hiram Thacker of Portland, Ind., besides a number of relatives and friends to grieve her departure.
Since her sister Martha disappeared after the 1900 census, and her sister Clarinda disappeared after the 1910 census, we can conclude that both of these individuals had died prior to 1917. Again, this is not helpful to this project, but interesting to note.
Penny Brown contributed a number of Thacker obituaries to the OHGen Web Ross County. One of these was for Frances’s daughter Catherine. The most important part of the obituary for our purposes is the sentence which states that she was “the daughter of Mr. and Mrs. Nicholas Thacker.” This obituary appeared in the Chillicothe Gazette on November 19, 1945.
Other obituaries that Penny contributed include one for Catherine’s husband Henry H. Thacker and a very sad obituary notice for their young son, Jesse Thacker, who drowned at the age of 17.
Finally, we have the obituary of Louisa Thacker Garrett which appeared in The Portsmouth Times, Portsmouth, Ohio, Page 10, Column 2, February 5, 1948.
Mrs. Louisa T. Garrett
Mrs. Louisa Thacker Garrett, 86, of Highland Bend, died at 8:20 p.m., Wednesday at Portsmouth General Hospital. She was admitted there five days ago. She had been ill for two months.
Mrs. Garrett, the last of 13 children, was born August 14, 1861, in Vinton Co., a daughter of Nimrod and Frances Thacker. She was the widow of Charles M. Garrett who died in 1942. She was a member of the United Brethren Church.
Mrs. Garrett is survived by daughters, Mrs. Mary Hampton; 2004 Sunrise Avenue, Mrs. Lottie Tipton of Sciotoville; two sons, Charles Garrett of Highland Bend and N. N. Garrett of Columbus, 27 grandchildren and 48 great grandchildren. Four daughters preceded her in death.
Funeral services will be held at 2 p.m. Saturday at Gill funeral home with Rev. M. S. Cunningham officiating. Intermet will be at Memorial Park Cemetery. The body will remain at the funeral home.
From the perspective of our investigation it is interesting to note how her parents are listed as Nimrod and Frances. Her obituary is the only one to call Nicholas, Nimrod, although it should be noted that Louisa named one of her sons, Nimrod, so that may be why the name stuck with whoever was responsible for the obituary.
Also it is interesting to see that Louisa’s obituary states that she was the last of 13 children. Thirteen is also the number that was listed for Frances in the 1900 census. Since I have only identified 12, this could be the source of some future investigation.
The truth is, however, the obituaries have done little to clarify or enhance our current investigation. Obituaries are notorious for being sketchy or containing inaccurate information. Unless the person who died left a copy for their own obituary, it is easy to see why this would be. Most of the time, the information included in the obituary is second hand. Often it is given at a time when an individual might be overwrought or emotional at the death of a loved one, not to mention overwhelmed by all the details that must be seen to at the time of someone’s death.
This is something we might want to consider when, tomorrow, we look at death records.
References:
1. “Obituary of Nicholas Thacker, 8 January 1941,” Ancestry Tree Database, “ANCESTORS OF JOSEPH OGIER JOHNSON AND CAROLINE RACHAEL KRONK,” (http://www.ancestry.com/: accessed September 25, 2010).
2. “Obituary of Sarah Jane Thacker, 4 July 1917,” Ancestry Tree Database, “ANCESTORS OF JOSEPH OGIER JOHNSON AND CAROLINE RACHAEL KRONK,” (http://www.ancestry.com/: accessed September 25, 2010).
3. “Obituary of Catherine Thacker, 19 November 19 1945,” Ross County Obituaries, contributed by Penny Brown, “Ross County OHGenWeb,” (http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ohross/: accessed September 25, 2010).
4. “Obituary of Mrs. Louisa T. Garrett,” Portsmouth Times, 5 February 1948, p 10, col. 2.
With the advent of search engines like Google, suddenly you can find snippets of information that your 4th cousin once removed has posted online. I bet some of you found this post by that very same process. (Welcome, oh 3rd cousin twice removed!)
In fact, by this very same method, I found obituaries for three of Frances Thacker’s children – Nicholas Thacker, Sara Jane Thacker and Catherine Thacker Thacker. I also have a copy of Louisa Thacker Garrett’s obituary. (I will post a transcribed copy below.)
You can find a transcription of Nicholas Thacker’s obituary by checking out Lynn Byler’s, “ANCESTORS OF JOSEPH OGIER JOHNSON AND CAROLINE RACHAEL KRONK,” on Ancestry.com.
She gives the date of the obituary as January 8, 1941 but unfortunately no newspaper is listed. There is no mention of his parents, only the fact that he has three children living, “Frank Thacker, of Wilkesville and Herman, address unknown and one daughter Willidy Williams, Los Vegas, Nevada.” Nicholas himself was living at the home of Hiram Marks near Wilkesville.
Lynn also has the obituary for Sara Jane Thacker, which appeared according to Lynn in the Republican Tribune, July 4, 1917. It gives her parents as Mr. and Mrs. Nicholas Thacker. Interesting to those of researching her siblings but not germane to our current research quest, is the sentence that reads: She also leaves 2 sisters and 3 brothers to mourn their loss, Mrs. Henry Thacker, Chillicothe; Mrs. Charles Garrett of Wheelersburg; David Thacker of Hawk, Nicholas Thacker of Minerton; Hiram Thacker of Portland, Ind., besides a number of relatives and friends to grieve her departure.
Since her sister Martha disappeared after the 1900 census, and her sister Clarinda disappeared after the 1910 census, we can conclude that both of these individuals had died prior to 1917. Again, this is not helpful to this project, but interesting to note.
Penny Brown contributed a number of Thacker obituaries to the OHGen Web Ross County. One of these was for Frances’s daughter Catherine. The most important part of the obituary for our purposes is the sentence which states that she was “the daughter of Mr. and Mrs. Nicholas Thacker.” This obituary appeared in the Chillicothe Gazette on November 19, 1945.
Other obituaries that Penny contributed include one for Catherine’s husband Henry H. Thacker and a very sad obituary notice for their young son, Jesse Thacker, who drowned at the age of 17.
Finally, we have the obituary of Louisa Thacker Garrett which appeared in The Portsmouth Times, Portsmouth, Ohio, Page 10, Column 2, February 5, 1948.
Mrs. Louisa T. Garrett
Mrs. Louisa Thacker Garrett, 86, of Highland Bend, died at 8:20 p.m., Wednesday at Portsmouth General Hospital. She was admitted there five days ago. She had been ill for two months.
Mrs. Garrett, the last of 13 children, was born August 14, 1861, in Vinton Co., a daughter of Nimrod and Frances Thacker. She was the widow of Charles M. Garrett who died in 1942. She was a member of the United Brethren Church.
Mrs. Garrett is survived by daughters, Mrs. Mary Hampton; 2004 Sunrise Avenue, Mrs. Lottie Tipton of Sciotoville; two sons, Charles Garrett of Highland Bend and N. N. Garrett of Columbus, 27 grandchildren and 48 great grandchildren. Four daughters preceded her in death.
Funeral services will be held at 2 p.m. Saturday at Gill funeral home with Rev. M. S. Cunningham officiating. Intermet will be at Memorial Park Cemetery. The body will remain at the funeral home.
From the perspective of our investigation it is interesting to note how her parents are listed as Nimrod and Frances. Her obituary is the only one to call Nicholas, Nimrod, although it should be noted that Louisa named one of her sons, Nimrod, so that may be why the name stuck with whoever was responsible for the obituary.
Also it is interesting to see that Louisa’s obituary states that she was the last of 13 children. Thirteen is also the number that was listed for Frances in the 1900 census. Since I have only identified 12, this could be the source of some future investigation.
The truth is, however, the obituaries have done little to clarify or enhance our current investigation. Obituaries are notorious for being sketchy or containing inaccurate information. Unless the person who died left a copy for their own obituary, it is easy to see why this would be. Most of the time, the information included in the obituary is second hand. Often it is given at a time when an individual might be overwrought or emotional at the death of a loved one, not to mention overwhelmed by all the details that must be seen to at the time of someone’s death.
This is something we might want to consider when, tomorrow, we look at death records.
References:
1. “Obituary of Nicholas Thacker, 8 January 1941,” Ancestry Tree Database, “ANCESTORS OF JOSEPH OGIER JOHNSON AND CAROLINE RACHAEL KRONK,” (http://www.ancestry.com/: accessed September 25, 2010).
2. “Obituary of Sarah Jane Thacker, 4 July 1917,” Ancestry Tree Database, “ANCESTORS OF JOSEPH OGIER JOHNSON AND CAROLINE RACHAEL KRONK,” (http://www.ancestry.com/: accessed September 25, 2010).
3. “Obituary of Catherine Thacker, 19 November 19 1945,” Ross County Obituaries, contributed by Penny Brown, “Ross County OHGenWeb,” (http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ohross/: accessed September 25, 2010).
4. “Obituary of Mrs. Louisa T. Garrett,” Portsmouth Times, 5 February 1948, p 10, col. 2.
Wednesday, September 29, 2010
Mrs. Nimrod Thacker Part II ***** Genealogy by the Numbers - Census Records
Before we look at the census records, we should look at some limitations the family historian can encounter when using census records as a source of information.
1. The census is only a snapshot of the individual as of one particular date. From 1850 through 1900, that date was June 1 of the year the census was taken. If the individual married, gave birth, or died a month, a week or a day later that information would not (or perhaps it’s more accurate to say should not) be reflected in the census.
2. The federal census was only taken once every ten years. Family moves, the birth and death of a child, the switching of occupations along with a whole myriad of other changes would have been missed by the census.
3. The knowledge of the person answering the census taker’s questions. Sometimes there were language barriers that created inaccurate information. Sometimes an individual’s memory wasn’t particularly good. Sometimes people lied.
They lied to protect family secrets. They lied because they didn’t know the truth. They lied, because well, sometimes people just lie.
Occasionally (and it’s difficult to say how often this happened), after repeated attempts on the part of the census taker to interview the family, he would ask their neighbors for the information. Imagine your own neighbor answering questions about where your mother and father were born!
4. The information is only as good as the person recording it. The census taker’s job was an important one, and some were more diligent than others. They came to the job with their own prejudices, their own spelling flaws, even their own ability to write legibly! Add to that the fact that they had to be able to read and recopy their own notes accurately, and you can see there was a potential for problems.
(I’ve often wondered if you could compare the local copy with the one kept for the state and the one given to the federal government, how many would be completely identical.)
Okay, now that I’ve made you wonder if there is any value at all to looking at census records; let’s take a look at Mrs. Nimrod Thacker’s listings in the census.
Our subject (because I’m tired of writing Mrs. Nimrod Thacker and we haven’t decided as of yet how to refer to her) is listed in five census returns – the 1850, the 1860, the 1870, the 1880 and the 1900. Only a few fragments of the 1890 census survived the 1921 fire in the basement of Commerce Building in Washington DC and none of those fragments were for Vinton County.
Below is a jpeg copy of an excel spreadsheet I used to record the information of the five censuses.
So what, if anything can we conclude from our look at the census records?
One, we can conclude that she went by the name Frances (and that according to custom the name should probably be spelled with an “es”). Two, she was probably born in Virginia or possibly West Virginia. Three, it looks like a “J” initial is part of her name and finally, she most likely was born in either 1822 or 1823.
In Part III, we’ll look at several obituaries to see if they can add anything to our research.
References:
1. Wikipedia contributors, "Francis," Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis (accessed September 22, 2010.)
2. Wikipedia contributors, “1890 United States Census,” Wikipedia, The Free Enyclopedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1890_United_States_Census (accessed September 22, 2010.)
3. 1850 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 1024, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
4. 1860 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 728, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com
5. 1870 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 172, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
6. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 215, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
7. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 212, Head of Household, Enos Markum (sic), online digital image, Ancestry.com
8. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 143, Head of Household, David Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
9. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 213, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
10. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Jackson County, Washington Township, visit 78, Head of Household, Zebulon Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
11. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Harrison Township, visit 113, Head of Household Henry Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
12. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 218, Head of Household, Hiram Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
13. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 216, Head of Household, Charles Garret (sic), online digital image, Ancestry.com.
14. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 245, Head of Household, Frances J. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
15. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 231, Head of Household, Clarinda Marcum, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
16. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 213, Head of Household, Zeb M. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
17. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Vinton Township, visit 256, Head of Household, David Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
18. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 4, visit 283, Head of Household, Andrew H. DeCamp, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
19. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 229, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
20. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 6, visit 454, Head of Household, Henry Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
21. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 244, Head of Household, Hiram N. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
22. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Jackson County, Wellston Ward 4, visit 356, Head of Household, Charles Garrett, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
23. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 136, Head of Household, Waid (sic) Marcum, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
24. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Vinton Township, visit 201, Head of Household, David Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
25. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 3, visit 335, Head of Household, William M. Hindman, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
26. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 151, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com
27. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 4, visit 51, Head of Household, Henery (sic) Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
28. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Indiana, Jay County, Portland Ward 4, visit 164, Head of Household, Hiram H. (sic) Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
29. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Scioto County, Porter Township, visit 186, Head of Household, Charles M. Garrett, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
30. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 135, Head of Household, Joseph Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
31. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 180, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
32. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 4, visit 117, Head of Household, Henry Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
33. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 51, Head of Household, H.N. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
34. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Scioto County, Portsmouth Ward 4, visit 15, Head of Household, Enos Hampton, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
35. 1930 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Jackson County, Wellston Ward 4, visit 202, Head of Household, Nichols (sic) Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
36. 1930 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 140, Head of Household, Hiram N. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
37. 1930 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Scioto County, Portsmouth Ward 6, visit 464, Head of Household, Charles Garrett, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
38. Compiled service record, Nimrod N. Thacker, Pvt. Co. D, 194 Ohio Inf.; Carded Records, Volunteer Organization, Civil War; Records of the Adjutant General’s Office, 1780-1917, Record Group 94; National Archives, Washington, D.C.
39. Frances J. Thacker, widow’s pension no. 582204, certificate no. 404166, service of Nimrod N. Thacker (Pvt., Co. D, 194th Ohio Inf., Civil War), Case Files of Approved Pension Applications, 1863-1934, Civil War and Later pension files, Dept of Veteran Affairs National Archives, Washington, D.C.
1. The census is only a snapshot of the individual as of one particular date. From 1850 through 1900, that date was June 1 of the year the census was taken. If the individual married, gave birth, or died a month, a week or a day later that information would not (or perhaps it’s more accurate to say should not) be reflected in the census.
2. The federal census was only taken once every ten years. Family moves, the birth and death of a child, the switching of occupations along with a whole myriad of other changes would have been missed by the census.
3. The knowledge of the person answering the census taker’s questions. Sometimes there were language barriers that created inaccurate information. Sometimes an individual’s memory wasn’t particularly good. Sometimes people lied.
They lied to protect family secrets. They lied because they didn’t know the truth. They lied, because well, sometimes people just lie.
Occasionally (and it’s difficult to say how often this happened), after repeated attempts on the part of the census taker to interview the family, he would ask their neighbors for the information. Imagine your own neighbor answering questions about where your mother and father were born!
4. The information is only as good as the person recording it. The census taker’s job was an important one, and some were more diligent than others. They came to the job with their own prejudices, their own spelling flaws, even their own ability to write legibly! Add to that the fact that they had to be able to read and recopy their own notes accurately, and you can see there was a potential for problems.
(I’ve often wondered if you could compare the local copy with the one kept for the state and the one given to the federal government, how many would be completely identical.)
Okay, now that I’ve made you wonder if there is any value at all to looking at census records; let’s take a look at Mrs. Nimrod Thacker’s listings in the census.
Our subject (because I’m tired of writing Mrs. Nimrod Thacker and we haven’t decided as of yet how to refer to her) is listed in five census returns – the 1850, the 1860, the 1870, the 1880 and the 1900. Only a few fragments of the 1890 census survived the 1921 fire in the basement of Commerce Building in Washington DC and none of those fragments were for Vinton County.
Below is a jpeg copy of an excel spreadsheet I used to record the information of the five censuses.
A couple of extraneous items to note before we take a closer look at the information we are seeking.
Even though we know from military, pension, estate and marriage records that his legal name was Nimrod Thacker, you will note that in each census he is listed as Nicholas Thacker.
Though race wasn’t one of the issues that we are currently looking at, notice that Mrs. Thacker is listed as “mulatto” in the 1850, 1860, 1870 and 1880 census, while in 1900 she is listed as “white.”
The Spelling of Francis/Frances
With the exception of the 1850 census, where there was one column that read, “Person over 20 years of age who cannot read or write” and it was not checked, the rest of the census years seem to indicate that our subject was illiterate (as was her spouse.)
If she could not read or write, how could she know the correct spelling of her name? Therefore, on the question of how to spell the name Frances/Francis correctly, there is no correct spelling. However, since it is common in the United States for the “is” in Francis to refer to a male and the “es” in Frances to refer to a female, I’m changing my records to reflect the “es” spelling.
Name
Next, you will notice that that she is listed as either Frances (Francis) or Frances J. in all five census records. Not once is she referred to as “Mary” or “Frances Mary” or “Mary Frances.” However, I’ve already noted that Nimrod isn’t referred to as Nimrod even once in the census records, so this is not conclusive one way or another. It is something to keep in mind as we look at the other records. One thing is obvious, however, and that is in every day life she was referred to as Frances.
State of Birth
Where was Frances born? Well, if you look at the census, you would conclude that it has to be Virginia, not West Virginia. However, to be fair there was no West Virginia in 1850 and 1860, and it is certainly possible that if Frances was born in what was to become West Virginia, in her own mind she still felt she was a Virginian by birth.
According to a search of the 1870 census, only 7 individuals in the 1870 census of Vinton County said they were born in West Virginia; none of those were in the township of Wilkesville.
In 1880, only 77 individuals claimed West Virginia as their state of birth. Three of those lived in Wilkesville – Joseph J. Cline, Jacson Hayes, and Harriet Wetherholt.
125 people said they were born in West Virginia in the 1900 census of Vinton County. Of those, 43 lived in Wilkesville Township – none had the last name of Thacker.
Beginning in 1880, the census asked for the birthplace of the individual’s mother and father. It seemed prudent to take a look at where each of the children claimed their mother was born. All told, Frances’s children were found in an additional 31 census entries from 1880 until 1930.
Interestingly enough, in each of the 31 entries, whatever state was listed as the birthplace of Nimrod Thacker was also listed as the birthplace of Frances. Twice the state of birth was listed as unknown. In 1900, Clarinda Thacker Marcum’s listing gave her mother’s birthplace as unknown and this was also the case of the1930 listing for Louisa Thacker Garrett.
Four times, Frances’s birth state was listed as Ohio. Three of these belonged to Louise Thacker Garrett’s census listings for the years 1900, 1910 and 1920. Hiram N. Thacker listed his mother’s birthplace as Ohio in the 1930 census.
As for West Virginia, it was listed as the birthplace of Frances twice. Both times were in the 1910 census, once for son David Thacker and once for son Nicholas Thacker. The remaining 23 times the state of birth for Frances was given as Virginia.
It should be noted that in the 1910 census, sons Nicholas and David also listed their father’s place of birth as West Virginia. According to Nimrod’s own statement given on March 6, 1865 at the time of his military enlistment, his place of birth was Louisa County, Virginia.
Birth Month and Year
The only census to ask the question in which month of the year were you born was the 1900 census. The census taker listed the month of January as the month of Frances’s birth, making us lean toward the month of January as the correct month.
In the matter of year, that date is implied in the 1850, 1860, 1870 and 1880 censuses. Since all five censuses were as of June 1st, that helps us pinpoint the year a little easier. According to the 1850, 1860 and 1880 census (when her age given was 27, 37 and 57 respectively) she would have been born in 1823. In the 1870 census her age was given as 48, making her born in 1822. In the 1900 census, when a month and year were asked for, she gave her age as 78 and the year of her birth as 1822.
When I say she gave her age and year of birth in the 1900 census that may not have been strictly true. In 1893, when she was applying for the Civil War widow’s pension, it was mentioned several times that she had been confined to her bed for about five years, so perhaps someone else answered the questions for her.
Her son Hiram Thacker and his family are listed next to Frances in the 1900 census, as well as William H. Thacker, son of Holeman Thacker and Roxanne Napper Thacker who is listed after Frances in the census. Perhaps it was actually one of these individuals who answered the census taker’s questions.
So what, if anything can we conclude from our look at the census records?
One, we can conclude that she went by the name Frances (and that according to custom the name should probably be spelled with an “es”). Two, she was probably born in Virginia or possibly West Virginia. Three, it looks like a “J” initial is part of her name and finally, she most likely was born in either 1822 or 1823.
In Part III, we’ll look at several obituaries to see if they can add anything to our research.
References:
1. Wikipedia contributors, "Francis," Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis (accessed September 22, 2010.)
2. Wikipedia contributors, “1890 United States Census,” Wikipedia, The Free Enyclopedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1890_United_States_Census (accessed September 22, 2010.)
3. 1850 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 1024, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
4. 1860 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 728, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com
5. 1870 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 172, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
6. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 215, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
7. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 212, Head of Household, Enos Markum (sic), online digital image, Ancestry.com
8. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 143, Head of Household, David Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
9. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 213, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
10. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Jackson County, Washington Township, visit 78, Head of Household, Zebulon Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
11. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Harrison Township, visit 113, Head of Household Henry Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
12. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 218, Head of Household, Hiram Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
13. 1880 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 216, Head of Household, Charles Garret (sic), online digital image, Ancestry.com.
14. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 245, Head of Household, Frances J. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
15. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 231, Head of Household, Clarinda Marcum, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
16. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 213, Head of Household, Zeb M. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
17. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Vinton Township, visit 256, Head of Household, David Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
18. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 4, visit 283, Head of Household, Andrew H. DeCamp, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
19. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 229, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
20. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 6, visit 454, Head of Household, Henry Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
21. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 244, Head of Household, Hiram N. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
22. 1900 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Jackson County, Wellston Ward 4, visit 356, Head of Household, Charles Garrett, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
23. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 136, Head of Household, Waid (sic) Marcum, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
24. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Vinton Township, visit 201, Head of Household, David Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
25. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 3, visit 335, Head of Household, William M. Hindman, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
26. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 151, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com
27. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 4, visit 51, Head of Household, Henery (sic) Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
28. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Indiana, Jay County, Portland Ward 4, visit 164, Head of Household, Hiram H. (sic) Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
29. 1910 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Scioto County, Porter Township, visit 186, Head of Household, Charles M. Garrett, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
30. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 135, Head of Household, Joseph Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
31. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 180, Head of Household, Nicholas Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
32. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Ross County, Chillicothe Ward 4, visit 117, Head of Household, Henry Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
33. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 51, Head of Household, H.N. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
34. 1920 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Scioto County, Portsmouth Ward 4, visit 15, Head of Household, Enos Hampton, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
35. 1930 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Jackson County, Wellston Ward 4, visit 202, Head of Household, Nichols (sic) Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
36. 1930 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Vinton County, Wilkesville Township, visit 140, Head of Household, Hiram N. Thacker, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
37. 1930 US Federal Census, State of Ohio, Scioto County, Portsmouth Ward 6, visit 464, Head of Household, Charles Garrett, online digital image, Ancestry.com.
38. Compiled service record, Nimrod N. Thacker, Pvt. Co. D, 194 Ohio Inf.; Carded Records, Volunteer Organization, Civil War; Records of the Adjutant General’s Office, 1780-1917, Record Group 94; National Archives, Washington, D.C.
39. Frances J. Thacker, widow’s pension no. 582204, certificate no. 404166, service of Nimrod N. Thacker (Pvt., Co. D, 194th Ohio Inf., Civil War), Case Files of Approved Pension Applications, 1863-1934, Civil War and Later pension files, Dept of Veteran Affairs National Archives, Washington, D.C.
Tuesday, September 28, 2010
Mrs. Nimrod Thacker Part I ****** Genealogy by the Numbers - Majority Rules
Because I am a bit of a statistics geek, and because a couple of Thacker family researchers and I have kicked around theories about the identity of Nimrod Thacker’s wife, I decided to take a look at what conclusions other researchers have come to in the identity of Mrs. T.
So on a recent perusal of Ancestry.com, I took a look and found Nimrod’s wife listed twenty times. I used Private Family Trees, Public Family Trees, One Family Trees and Ancestry Family Trees as the source of my information. Below is a break down how Mrs. Nimrod Thacker was listed.
Name of Mrs. Nimrod Nicholas Thacker
1 listed her as Frances ?
1 listed her as Mary Grover
1 listed her as Frances J. Thacker
2 listed her as Francis Thacker
2 listed her as Francis J. Thacker
3 listed her as Francis
4 listed her as Frances Mary Grover
6 listed her as Mary Frances Grover
Not only couldn’t the twenty researchers agree on her name, but they couldn’t agree on how to spell Frances (or is that Francis?).
Spelling of Frances/Francis
1 had no Frances/Francis listed in the name
7 spelled it Francis
12 spelled it Frances
Hmmm…. Not exactly an overwhelming consensus either way at the spelling of the name. Okay, what do the Researchers have to say about the first name of Mrs. Thacker?
First Name
7 give the first name as Mary
13 give the first name as Frances/Francis
What about the middle name?
Middle Name
3 give the initial “J”
4 say the middle name is Mary
6 say the middle name is Frances/Francis
7 of our researchers give no middle name or initial
Last Name
4 give no last name
5 give the last name as Thacker
11 give the last name as Grover
So, what about the year of birth?
Year of Birth
2 give the year of birth as 1822
4 give the year of birth as 1821
5 have no year of birth given
9 give year of birth as 1823
Month Born
3 give the birth month of February
5 give the birth month of January
12 give no month
State of Birth
2 give no state of birth
5 give West Virginia as the state of birth
12 give Virginia as the state of birth
If majority rules then Mrs. Nimrod Thacker was Frances no middle name or initial Grover, born in no month of the year 1823 in the State of Virginia. Case closed, right?
Well, no, not exactly. That’s not how genealogy works, or at least it shouldn’t. When there are clear discrepancies in the identity of an individual, we need to take a look at whatever actual documents exist, evaluate them and then come to our own conclusion. Or as Elizabeth Shown Mills said more elegantly in the Forward to her book, “Evidence Explained:”
At the root of everything we find in history is a source. The information we pull from a source will not likely be any better than the source itself. The conclusions we reach from it can be no better than the effort we have made to identify that source, to understand its nuances, and to interpret the evidence its information provides.
In the next several posts, we will examine census records, death records, obituaries, a marriage record, an application for appointment, a compiled military file, and a Civil War Pension file to see if we can clear up some of the confusion on the identity of Nimrod’s wife.
References:
1. Ancestry.com, “Family Trees,” databases, http://www.ancestry.com/: September 22, 2010.
2. Mills, Elizabeth Shown. Evidence Explained: Citing History Sources from Artifacts to Cyberspace, Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Company, 2007.
So on a recent perusal of Ancestry.com, I took a look and found Nimrod’s wife listed twenty times. I used Private Family Trees, Public Family Trees, One Family Trees and Ancestry Family Trees as the source of my information. Below is a break down how Mrs. Nimrod Thacker was listed.
Name of Mrs. Nimrod Nicholas Thacker
1 listed her as Frances ?
1 listed her as Mary Grover
1 listed her as Frances J. Thacker
2 listed her as Francis Thacker
2 listed her as Francis J. Thacker
3 listed her as Francis
4 listed her as Frances Mary Grover
6 listed her as Mary Frances Grover
Not only couldn’t the twenty researchers agree on her name, but they couldn’t agree on how to spell Frances (or is that Francis?).
Spelling of Frances/Francis
1 had no Frances/Francis listed in the name
7 spelled it Francis
12 spelled it Frances
Hmmm…. Not exactly an overwhelming consensus either way at the spelling of the name. Okay, what do the Researchers have to say about the first name of Mrs. Thacker?
First Name
7 give the first name as Mary
13 give the first name as Frances/Francis
What about the middle name?
Middle Name
3 give the initial “J”
4 say the middle name is Mary
6 say the middle name is Frances/Francis
7 of our researchers give no middle name or initial
Last Name
4 give no last name
5 give the last name as Thacker
11 give the last name as Grover
So, what about the year of birth?
Year of Birth
2 give the year of birth as 1822
4 give the year of birth as 1821
5 have no year of birth given
9 give year of birth as 1823
Month Born
3 give the birth month of February
5 give the birth month of January
12 give no month
State of Birth
2 give no state of birth
5 give West Virginia as the state of birth
12 give Virginia as the state of birth
If majority rules then Mrs. Nimrod Thacker was Frances no middle name or initial Grover, born in no month of the year 1823 in the State of Virginia. Case closed, right?
Well, no, not exactly. That’s not how genealogy works, or at least it shouldn’t. When there are clear discrepancies in the identity of an individual, we need to take a look at whatever actual documents exist, evaluate them and then come to our own conclusion. Or as Elizabeth Shown Mills said more elegantly in the Forward to her book, “Evidence Explained:”
At the root of everything we find in history is a source. The information we pull from a source will not likely be any better than the source itself. The conclusions we reach from it can be no better than the effort we have made to identify that source, to understand its nuances, and to interpret the evidence its information provides.
In the next several posts, we will examine census records, death records, obituaries, a marriage record, an application for appointment, a compiled military file, and a Civil War Pension file to see if we can clear up some of the confusion on the identity of Nimrod’s wife.
References:
1. Ancestry.com, “Family Trees,” databases, http://www.ancestry.com/: September 22, 2010.
2. Mills, Elizabeth Shown. Evidence Explained: Citing History Sources from Artifacts to Cyberspace, Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Company, 2007.
Wednesday, December 10, 2008
The Children of Nimrod Nicholas and Frances J. Thacker
Finally, finally, thanks to help from some fellow Thacker researchers, I feel confident that I have identified 12 of Nimrod and Francis Thacker’s children.
Okay, so you’re not impressed by this bit of news, but when you have a ton of Thackers living in the Wilkesville area of Vinton County and the Ray area of Jackson County with a penchant for naming their children a handful of names (Sarah, Catherine, Mary, Martha, David, Hiram), it’s not all that easy to figure out who belongs to whom.
Francis Thacker was enumerated in the 1900 census, and at that time, she said that she had 13 children and only 8 were still living. I’m still missing the 13th child, and unless someone comes up with a family bible, I don’t think I’m going to be able to find this child. I’ve been to Curry Cemetery where four of the children are buried, and there appears to be no marker for this last child.
The known children are:
!. Clarinda Thacker born March 1841
2. Martha Ann Thacker born Sept 1844
3. David Thacker August 3, 1846
4. Algerine Thacker approx. 1848
5. Sarah J. Thacker October 23, 1849
6. Ambrose C. Thacker approx. 1851
7. Nicholas Thacker March 24, 1852
8. Mary Francis Thacker May 19, 1854
9. Catherine Thacker March 03, 1855
10. Hiram N. Thacker April 14, 1858
11. Hannah N. Thacker approx. Feb or March 1860
12 Louise E. Thacker August 14, 1861
Over the next few posts, I’ll be discussing each of these children along with the source of my evidence, which will allow you to evaluate the information for yourself.
At the time of Nimrod N. Thacker’s death in July of 1893, letters of appointment indicate besides his widow, Francis J. Thacker, the following individuals were said to be his only heirs at law:
Clarinda Markham – Daughter
Martha A. Thacker – Daughter
David Thacker – Son
Sarah J. Waldren – Daughter
Catherine Thacker – Daughter
Nicholas Thacker – Son
Hiram Thacker – Son
Louisa Garrett – Daughter
Viola Thacker – Granddaughter
Claudy Thacker – Grandson
A big tip of the hat to Judy for providing me with the information on the Letters of Appointment – this confirmed the identities of a couple of the children and took away any lingering doubts. Thanks Judy!
Okay, so you’re not impressed by this bit of news, but when you have a ton of Thackers living in the Wilkesville area of Vinton County and the Ray area of Jackson County with a penchant for naming their children a handful of names (Sarah, Catherine, Mary, Martha, David, Hiram), it’s not all that easy to figure out who belongs to whom.
Francis Thacker was enumerated in the 1900 census, and at that time, she said that she had 13 children and only 8 were still living. I’m still missing the 13th child, and unless someone comes up with a family bible, I don’t think I’m going to be able to find this child. I’ve been to Curry Cemetery where four of the children are buried, and there appears to be no marker for this last child.
The known children are:
!. Clarinda Thacker born March 1841
2. Martha Ann Thacker born Sept 1844
3. David Thacker August 3, 1846
4. Algerine Thacker approx. 1848
5. Sarah J. Thacker October 23, 1849
6. Ambrose C. Thacker approx. 1851
7. Nicholas Thacker March 24, 1852
8. Mary Francis Thacker May 19, 1854
9. Catherine Thacker March 03, 1855
10. Hiram N. Thacker April 14, 1858
11. Hannah N. Thacker approx. Feb or March 1860
12 Louise E. Thacker August 14, 1861
Over the next few posts, I’ll be discussing each of these children along with the source of my evidence, which will allow you to evaluate the information for yourself.
At the time of Nimrod N. Thacker’s death in July of 1893, letters of appointment indicate besides his widow, Francis J. Thacker, the following individuals were said to be his only heirs at law:
Clarinda Markham – Daughter
Martha A. Thacker – Daughter
David Thacker – Son
Sarah J. Waldren – Daughter
Catherine Thacker – Daughter
Nicholas Thacker – Son
Hiram Thacker – Son
Louisa Garrett – Daughter
Viola Thacker – Granddaughter
Claudy Thacker – Grandson
A big tip of the hat to Judy for providing me with the information on the Letters of Appointment – this confirmed the identities of a couple of the children and took away any lingering doubts. Thanks Judy!
Monday, November 17, 2008
A Little Hand-Wringing Angst
You will notice, of course, that I have not written a post on this blog for quite some time. It was intentional, the not writing, that is. There were individuals in my family who very gently told me that they were uncomfortable with my poking around in our racial stew. Live relatives or dead ancestors, well, the choice is obvious. Live relatives win hands down.
This doesn’t mean, however, that I have stopped the search. I haven’t. I’ve just self-muzzled myself with what I have been finding. I’ve missed the writing. It’s my own way of sorting things out, hoping for a brief moment of self-enlightenment here and there.
I had a bit of hand-wringing the other day when I accidentally discovered that my blog was listed under the category “African American genealogy.” It made me uncomfortable on several levels, not the least of which was that I knew there might be certain family members who would not be happy with that characterization.
The second issue was that I felt like an imposter. I don’t know that my ancestors had African American blood flowing through their veins, and the labeling of my blog as an African American genealogy blog made me feel as if I had been let into an exclusive club under false pretenses.
On the other hand, the classic definition of mulatto is a person of mixed black and white ancestry. So the fact that my fourth great grandparents, Nimrod and Frances Thacker, had an “m” beside their names in the 1850, 1860, 1870 and 1880 census made my protesting that the family may have been NA as opposed to AA seem like I was just another white chick living in denial. Sending the message that having a Native American background is preferable to having an African American background hasn’t been my intention.
For someone whose only goal has been finding the truth, I seem to have been permanently perched on the edge of racial incorrectness.
At the very end of their lives, my “m” ancestors, Nimrod and Frances became “w’s.” On both of their records in the Death Register at the Probate Court in Vinton County, Nimrod who died in 1893 and Frances who died in 1901 are listed as white.
If the whole discussion of the racial make up of my ancestors creates such confusion and angst for yours truly, you have to wonder what it was like for Nimrod and Frances who lived it.
This doesn’t mean, however, that I have stopped the search. I haven’t. I’ve just self-muzzled myself with what I have been finding. I’ve missed the writing. It’s my own way of sorting things out, hoping for a brief moment of self-enlightenment here and there.
I had a bit of hand-wringing the other day when I accidentally discovered that my blog was listed under the category “African American genealogy.” It made me uncomfortable on several levels, not the least of which was that I knew there might be certain family members who would not be happy with that characterization.
The second issue was that I felt like an imposter. I don’t know that my ancestors had African American blood flowing through their veins, and the labeling of my blog as an African American genealogy blog made me feel as if I had been let into an exclusive club under false pretenses.
On the other hand, the classic definition of mulatto is a person of mixed black and white ancestry. So the fact that my fourth great grandparents, Nimrod and Frances Thacker, had an “m” beside their names in the 1850, 1860, 1870 and 1880 census made my protesting that the family may have been NA as opposed to AA seem like I was just another white chick living in denial. Sending the message that having a Native American background is preferable to having an African American background hasn’t been my intention.
For someone whose only goal has been finding the truth, I seem to have been permanently perched on the edge of racial incorrectness.
At the very end of their lives, my “m” ancestors, Nimrod and Frances became “w’s.” On both of their records in the Death Register at the Probate Court in Vinton County, Nimrod who died in 1893 and Frances who died in 1901 are listed as white.
If the whole discussion of the racial make up of my ancestors creates such confusion and angst for yours truly, you have to wonder what it was like for Nimrod and Frances who lived it.
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